Hey guys. In the last week or so, we have done a lot of test pressings that have audible pops in them. These are not skips, but pops. We are trying to figure out what is going on, but also are not wanting to jump to uninformed conclusions.
The question is...is this a cutting, plating or pressing issue? I know that is very broad, but I am hard pressed to figure out how cutting could do this.
The plant has a troubleshooting guide that indicates a defect in the vinyl (it happens on every record of the run in the same spot, so we are ruling that out) or bad silvering on the stamper.
Any input or opinions would be great. Thanks!
Pops in a test pressing.
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concretecowboy71
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normally, this is a galvanic problem, at cutting, you normally
don´t get pops, I have heard rumours about little gas bubbles inside
laquers, but I didn´t see any problem like this.
But, if you have pops on some productions, this is also not
the source...
I think, galvano.
Make a new cut and galvano, you will see, problem is fixed
don´t get pops, I have heard rumours about little gas bubbles inside
laquers, but I didn´t see any problem like this.
But, if you have pops on some productions, this is also not
the source...
I think, galvano.
Make a new cut and galvano, you will see, problem is fixed
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Aussie0zborn
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concretecowboy71
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- Location: Cleveland, Ohio, USA
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concretecowboy71
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- Joined: Mon Mar 08, 2010 10:13 am
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Picture of latest pop...
[img]
http://www.wellmademusic.net/images/pop.jpg
[/img]
What do you think??
Thanks
[img]
http://www.wellmademusic.net/images/pop.jpg
[/img]
What do you think??
Thanks
Pops and Clicks
Ok Pops and clicks!!!!
For many year it was common prictice to de-click all mothers prior to stamper production
Pops the same I wonder why!!!!!!
Look If you get a cut a mother and a stamper pop and click free it is a case of good luck rather than good management OK!
Now when you get one that clicks and pops best is to do another cut and start from scratch simple as that OK!
I am not going to say what is the best way to avoid it as there is no best way but here is what happens generally
Very fine "hair" gets left behind on the lacquer adhering to the cut surface on one end the other end is of course loose
It will not get washed off during preperation, as the lacquer gets silvered this fine bit of "hair" or horn as it was called it will get a coating itself normal stuff
Than the lacquer goes into the bath and guess what that tiny winny little bit of "hair" will attract a larger share of the nickel during plating there fore clicks and pops
It is like a lightning arrestor attracting current to it
Electricity loves to flow through pointy things and this is a pointy thing for sure
Problems with the "galvano" process will manifest it self in other ways besides clicks and pops
Things like rough background noise hissing rumble on both channels high pitch surface noise heart beats etc etc etc
If you have a pop and click in the same spot it is not galvanics it has originated from the lacquer
The frasturating thing is that when you play back the lacquer it is not there as it has been removed in the separation process so the lacquer will most likely play very clean, but the pozi wont it will be there for sure That is if you are making a pozi Something that nowdays with small runs is not common practice
(I am reviewing this as at the cost of lacquers it now pays to make a pozi rather than another cut)
Now unless you are prepared to play back the pozi and de click it, make another stamper from the pozi your next choice is another cut
By the way a standard Stanley knife blade is the right angle so as to de click a pozi,
It is not hard at all play it back mark the spot do the dj trick back and forth look at it under the micro get the blade in a steady hand at the right angle and just press the blade on it Wash with d water play it again Gone, about 2 minutes if you already have a pressing as a reference
The full length is played if you are doing QC on a new pozi before plating a stamper from it about an hour and a half
It is a balancing act in terms of time/money
Now all the Johny come lateley's will tell you all sorts of things
They fall in a simple trap and that is the fact that having played back the lacquer it is as clean as a whistle so they say to the galvano man " the lacquer is clean it is your bath"
Crap! it was on the lacquer but it aint there any longer simple as that
Now anything else you will hear on this remains just that, Crap
It has always and it will allways be the case with clicks and pops so long as you cut on acetates
In my younger days working in a fully integrated plant doing around 15-20 K pressings a day we had 4 full time girls de-clicking and de popping mothers every day of the week
Obviously the owners where stupid employing these girls and paying them good money Hey! what do you and others think?
Cheers
For many year it was common prictice to de-click all mothers prior to stamper production
Pops the same I wonder why!!!!!!
Look If you get a cut a mother and a stamper pop and click free it is a case of good luck rather than good management OK!
Now when you get one that clicks and pops best is to do another cut and start from scratch simple as that OK!
I am not going to say what is the best way to avoid it as there is no best way but here is what happens generally
Very fine "hair" gets left behind on the lacquer adhering to the cut surface on one end the other end is of course loose
It will not get washed off during preperation, as the lacquer gets silvered this fine bit of "hair" or horn as it was called it will get a coating itself normal stuff
Than the lacquer goes into the bath and guess what that tiny winny little bit of "hair" will attract a larger share of the nickel during plating there fore clicks and pops
It is like a lightning arrestor attracting current to it
Electricity loves to flow through pointy things and this is a pointy thing for sure
Problems with the "galvano" process will manifest it self in other ways besides clicks and pops
Things like rough background noise hissing rumble on both channels high pitch surface noise heart beats etc etc etc
If you have a pop and click in the same spot it is not galvanics it has originated from the lacquer
The frasturating thing is that when you play back the lacquer it is not there as it has been removed in the separation process so the lacquer will most likely play very clean, but the pozi wont it will be there for sure That is if you are making a pozi Something that nowdays with small runs is not common practice
(I am reviewing this as at the cost of lacquers it now pays to make a pozi rather than another cut)
Now unless you are prepared to play back the pozi and de click it, make another stamper from the pozi your next choice is another cut
By the way a standard Stanley knife blade is the right angle so as to de click a pozi,
It is not hard at all play it back mark the spot do the dj trick back and forth look at it under the micro get the blade in a steady hand at the right angle and just press the blade on it Wash with d water play it again Gone, about 2 minutes if you already have a pressing as a reference
The full length is played if you are doing QC on a new pozi before plating a stamper from it about an hour and a half
It is a balancing act in terms of time/money
Now all the Johny come lateley's will tell you all sorts of things
They fall in a simple trap and that is the fact that having played back the lacquer it is as clean as a whistle so they say to the galvano man " the lacquer is clean it is your bath"
Crap! it was on the lacquer but it aint there any longer simple as that
Now anything else you will hear on this remains just that, Crap
It has always and it will allways be the case with clicks and pops so long as you cut on acetates
In my younger days working in a fully integrated plant doing around 15-20 K pressings a day we had 4 full time girls de-clicking and de popping mothers every day of the week
Obviously the owners where stupid employing these girls and paying them good money Hey! what do you and others think?
Cheers
Chris
-
concretecowboy71
- Posts: 569
- Joined: Mon Mar 08, 2010 10:13 am
- Location: Cleveland, Ohio, USA
- Contact:
Hey allthomas wrote:thats not the pressing.
what causes the very fine hair? material or machine?
Over the many years since acetates where introduced there has been quite a few proposals suggestions explanations conjectures theories etc etc etc as to what the cause is and how to prevent it avoid it
None seem to have worked so far however a cutting stylus that is heated to the right level for the lacquer one is cutting at that point in time seems to prevent pops and clicks most of the time
It is a combination of material, stylus, as well as an unwanted disturbance of the signal in the cutting process as it seems that it is as random an occurance that has defied explanation for many years
Cheers
Chris