Made A Trip to Germany Last Week: Newbilt

[SUNBEARS]

So, Walter (my colleague here at Twin Hill/Berlin Mastering), and I flew to Germany last week for the Newbilt Open House and it was all very exciting. Got to see the presses full mechanics, however no pressing because there is no in house boiler. They are working on some exciting things with the Newbilts and I can't wait to bring pressing back to the SouthEast USA.

Cheers,
J

[Aussie0zborn]

You flew to Germany and you didn't see these machines pressing records?

Who invites people from all over the world for the launch of new record presses and doesn't have them running when a small electric steam boiler can be rented for $100 per day? Electric steam boilers don't have a chimney stack so its plug and play.

Be aware that CD/DVD equipment manufacturers would set up entire CD/DVD moulding and finishing machines at 3-day TRADE SHOWS in exhibition halls all over the world. And these machines need a small power plant to run them. So if they can do that, I'm sure the Newbilt people could have hired a small boiler that can be transported on a trailer attached to the back of a little car to give a real demonstration of the machines pressing records.

In my opinion, these machines are not finished yet and that's why they were not pressing but I'm sure they will get there. The lack of a boiler is not a good enough excuse to not have seen these machines pressing records. I would say their "open house" was incredibly premature and probably a bid to secure deposits to raise finance.

You need to see them working before putting any money down. I'm sure they will be great presses when they're finished but this "open house" without pressing records raises a red flag. I hope I'm wrong.

[untitledthe]

Thanks for sharing a photo, great to see a picture of the press instead of a render from photoshop.
To bad they didnt have them up and running, you would expect that.

[mossboss]

No doubt they will get themshelves sorted in due course no way they would go that far and give up.
I am sure there will be another open day with the press running
Best

[rsimms3]

How does this press work? Based on the picture it looks like the biscuit is placed in the book while in the rear of the machine, the book moves forward to the middle of the sled, the book is pressed, and then moves forward where the top of the book is opened automatically as it comes against the curved rail so that the record can be manually extracted.

[mossboss]

Labels and puck are placed in the book moulds as you see them in the picture
There is a cylinder at the rear of the press that pushes the mould out than pulls the moulds into the open press when the time comes for the press to close
Of course as the top part of the mould rides on the sickle and the bottom is on a rail which is fixed on the platten the movement forward will open the moulds and backwards they will close to about 1 1/2"
Once the pulled into the press, according to time settings the press closes with full pressure applied to the moulds than the record is formed
Now
While the moulds are in the position as in the picture steam is injected into the moulds to pre heat them
Once the pre heat time has elapsed the controller activates the rear cylinder the moulds are pulled into the press
The press than closes and goes into dwell time further heating the moulds while the press is closed
Once the dwell time runs out cold water is admitted to the moulds and once the cooling down time has elapsed the press opens
When it is opened the cylinder at the rear pushes out the moulds outwards and since the top rides on the sickle and the bottom is kept at the bottom platen by the rail the top mould opens to about 45-50 degrees, the record is removed and the cycle is repeated
As each plant has its own peculiarities cycle time can differ dramatically
Generally you would have about the following settings time settings are quite arbitrary
Interval = 4 seconds enough time to place the labels and the puck
Pre heat = 8 seconds
Dwell = 4 seconds
Cooling = 16 seconds
As Pointed out the above are average and are about right for a typical plant with steam at 170 psi, water at 21 degrees c
The boiler has to be sufficient to supply the press without steam pressure drop
The plant needs to also be equipped with good high pressure high volume water pumps to get the volume of water through the moulds at the highest speed possible
Good hydraulics with a decent size accumulator so as to get the press closed quick ensuring no lag in the hydraulic system preventing rejects due to system fluctuating pressure
If the press while closing is taking the total of the hydraulic pump capacity or near its limit the press will slow down the moment it finds resistance that will cause a reject as the puck is squeezed and than the lag caused by the hydraulic system will result in non fill or stitching the press must close smoothly all the way to the final squeeze without any variation in closing speed until the final 5 mm before the mould are completely closed
Total around the 32 seconds with a good operator, a bit of speed taken in liquid form keeps them on for about 6 hours without about 4 hours and they get a bit dizzy. Ha
Really at that speed an operator needs a break at about the half way mark into his shift
Best

[yilin]

thanks for sharing your experience. I was invited to their open house. due to my schedule, I did not attend.
But if I did not see the machine pressing the record, I will be disappoint.
I have watched the video from youtube. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uby5-HinbGU
at 3:40, QRP use Finebilt pressing a record.
will the Newbilt be running like that?
like AussieOzborn said, I have to see the machine working before I put the money in. because it is not cheap for a single press.

Cheers,

[Aussie0zborn]

Yes the Newbilt looks the same as a Finebilt. The Finebilt and previous German copies use springs to pull the lower platen back down. I think Newbilt use hydraulics to do that so they have made some improvements. [Edit 6-OCT-15 : I now see in the photo above that this press actually has the Finebilt style return springs for some unknown reason].

You can see a Finebilt press in operation in these short videos :

http://youtu.be/4TsQQ3-fuBA
http://youtu.be/Y5Y7Y4e8s0c
http://youtu.be/bXwm7EqYlVU

[untitledthe]

In the videos you see the operators make a sandwich step by step in the press, or even cutting a finished record first before they prepare a new round,.. From a pratical and rookie point of view, isnt it possible to make a sandwich of labels and cookie on forehand so you only have to place it in the press when its ready? To hard to center and misprints?

[opcode66]

My guess... You don't want to let it start cooling. Hot biscuit right in and start pressing. Guessing.

[Aussie0zborn]

Each half of the mould has a centre pin that the labels need to be affixed to. If you build a sandwich of puck and labels and place it on the bottom pin the top label might not align with the top pin and you have an off centre label which equals a reject.

There are other methods with a manual press where you can build a sandwich and put it on the bottom pin but this needs a long fixed bottom pin, no top pin (just a hole in the bush) and an extruder that makes a hole in the puck. It's all a bit too much trouble really.

The object of the game is to load the press and not keep it waiting. Another object of the game is to trim that record before the edge cools and becomes impossible to trim. Another object of the game is not to rest the record on anything except the trimmer.

[untitledthe]

Thanks for clearing that out AussieOzBorn. It seemed unefficient but it comes down to do everthing at once.

[SUNBEARS]

Since this NewBilt company is partnered with RPA, I have no doubt that these units will be fully functional and not a scam. They are including a technician for install as well when the Machines arrive.

Some improvements they have made from the old FineBilts include computer controllers that are all talking and listening to each other. You could have two presses set up with different size projects on them and have the extruder in the center. The computers tell the extruder at what point in the cycle each press is, and the extruder delivery the appropriate amount of material for each press. Kinda cool. They are also using this tech for full automation to come in 2016. Pretty exciting stuff.

[mossboss]

Untitled
The moulds do not have fixed pins. The top pin protrudes by about 5-6 mm 1/4" but behind it is a stiff piece of rubber
The label is placed on it as well as the bottom pin
When the moulds are drawn into the plates and the press closes the pins meet face to face the rubber allows the top pin to move back so they do not destroy each other
The hole is formed as such
On the alpha machines the top pin is fixed but the bottom is moveable with an air cylinder fitted within the bottom platten which acts in the same fashion like a cushion
By restricting the amount of air released from the cylinder on the closing of the press the top pin pushes the bottom pin down forming the hole once the press is open the cylinder is activate pushing the pin back up again after a delay of a few seconds giving the operator enough time to remove the record
Newbilt,
As I have already pointed out this machine will become a reality despite the doubts posted here
I imagine that automation will be a rather cumbersome affair due to book moulds
Nothing new in automating a book mould press but if you see them they are a very cumbersome setup regardless it worked back than no reason it would not work again
Best

[Aussie0zborn]

Nobody said this is a scam.

As for one extruder making two different sized pucks, this has been done before with a local modification of Toolex extruders right here in Australia 30 years ago.

With today's technology, you would expect such improvements. No big deal there.

The big deal is having an Open Day and not having just one press making records. Thats mighty unusual but I'm sure it's not too far off now.

[SUNBEARS]

Robots

[untitledthe]

Thats one way to go, offcourse these robots can automate everthing. I even lost a job because of it but i bet they are pretty sensitive to interference in a process like this. I wonder how they are implememt these robots.

[untitledthe]

Untitled
The moulds do not have fixed pins. The top pin protrudes by about 5-6 mm 1/4" but behind it is a stiff piece of rubber
The label is placed on it as well as the bottom pin
When the moulds are drawn into the plates and the press closes the pins meet face to face the rubber allows the top pin to move back so they do not destroy each other
The hole is formed as such

Oke i got a clue, its really something that you makes sence on the workfloor. Definitely something you would bring up buying new moulds i guess. Cheers.

[untitledthe]

Thats one way to go, offcourse these robots can automate everthing. I even lost a job because of it but i bet they are pretty sensitive to interference in a process like this. I wonder how they are implememt these robots.

Unfortunally cant edit this post, anyway actually lost a position to a robot back then, the operator responsible for the robot had alot of headaches due the malfunctions. They are also pretty steep in eurodollars. But maybe it works out with 3 presses or something.

[Aussie0zborn]

Hmmm... I don't want to be the bad guy here but I think the robot in the photo is a bit of a joke.

See the Toolex auto press in the background? It's automation consists of four air cylinders. Why would you use an expensive industrial robot when you can use four air cylinders to do the same job?

Why buy an industrial robot when you can buy another press with the same money and have some change left over to buy four air cylinders? The robot in the pic just doesn't make sense. Perhaps it's an "artist's impression" ?