vertical treble issues on T560?

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asqus
Posts: 32
Joined: Sun Sep 25, 2016 10:44 am

vertical treble issues on T560?

Post: # 47037Unread post asqus
Sun Jun 04, 2017 4:25 am

Hey all,

The part of the VR training where Souri explains the potential issues with vertical treble seems to have entirely left my memory. Can anyone remind me of what to check for/compare between vertical and horizontal treble? I remember him showing us some examples of tracks where the vertical treble was very different to the horizontal treble and demonstrating the issues this caused, but I cannot remember what they were.

The reason I ask is that I suspect it has something to do with a very problematic cut I'm seemingly unable to get right. It's a simple track - ukelele and female vocals - but for some reason it's sibilant as hell (and I've de-essed it massively already) and there's excessive background noise only on the left channel (which I don't experience with other cuts).

Is this the kind of issue that could be caused by vertical treble problems or am I remembering wrong?

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descent
Posts: 41
Joined: Sat Apr 16, 2016 7:29 pm

Re: vertical treble issues on T560?

Post: # 47090Unread post descent
Sat Jun 10, 2017 12:03 pm

Hello Aspus,
50% of the lathe cut trolls here are using T560, so I don't understand why no one replies you. Whatever.

T560 is a nice home made manual style cutting machine. Value for money and the most famous choice for all begginers (or not).
This meanes that you have the oportunity to cut music on a blank record without speanding 50.000 euro for your gear.
But as you imagine a home made machine had many limitations.

You can't cut a full range high frequencies audio track with this machine. Every time you must use desser or notch EQ filter to resolve the distructive high frequences... And yes the result everytime is close or far away from the master audio track... Also, depends from the music.
So, with vinyl optimizer, you can balance the vertical and horizontal treble frequences which are the guilty ones for the "harsh treble sound".
You can resolve the problem after some tests, but the sound will never be rich and clean as you wish.

I want to ask everybody. Is there out any guy who can modify a Neumann VMS70 cutter head on T560 model
:?: More, where we can finally buy a VMS70 cutter head? ...Questions, which will never aswered clearly.

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Ben
Posts: 138
Joined: Sat Nov 22, 2014 11:31 am
Location: Montreal, Canada
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Re: vertical treble issues on T560?

Post: # 47091Unread post Ben
Sat Jun 10, 2017 12:18 pm

You need to post an audio exemple of your cut.... it's hard to tell like that.

You need to always take care of the high frequency on the "side" ...especially on the VR.... but even major album Lp's that were cut on big expensive machine (Placebo - Sleeping with ghosts) you can really hear the harshness of his "sss" and it's sounds horrible. so it's not only related to the VR.

that's my 2 cents

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asqus
Posts: 32
Joined: Sun Sep 25, 2016 10:44 am

Re: vertical treble issues on T560?

Post: # 47105Unread post asqus
Tue Jun 13, 2017 2:13 am

Thanks guys, this is very helpful.

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JP_
Posts: 33
Joined: Mon Mar 10, 2014 9:44 am

Re: vertical treble issues on T560?

Post: # 47112Unread post JP_
Wed Jun 14, 2017 2:57 am

Theres no diff between treble in both channels. The main problem is that the level of the vertical channel is often much lower and distortion becomes more obvious therefore. Thats all.
Im using a VR without any problems here, cuts are very good with low distortion (especially when comparing to pressed records). Its really not about the t560, its mostly about how you cut. One main problem I see is that most VR-users have bad monitoring in a bad room, so itsvery hard to prepare a usefull master to cut from. This definitly not helps to calibrate the lathe and the master. Due to this we often read about "problems" with or downsides of a VR, that simply not exists in a careful designed setup. I have won shootouts against other very well regarded facilities with lacquer dubs cutted on full equipted neumanns. So yes, a VR definitly can work flawlessly, but its not a set and forget machine, just like any lathe. You will loose blood and tears and hair before you are able to master it, for sure. Just like any lathe. And if you try to cut bad sounding music every lathe will fail. Proper mastering for vinyl and cutting records is an art form which takes years and years to learn. Without a controlled environment its certainly blind flying in most cases...

Im running a pro mastering facility (regularly doing premasters for vinyl for all kind of labels) while occasionally doing cuts on a VR. Very happy with it atm. Running a neumann to cut lacquers would be nice of course, but the current completly crazy expenses arent really worse it. Its just so out of control atm.

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GEEKKCC
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Joined: Wed Dec 05, 2018 10:12 am

Re: vertical treble issues on T560?

Post: # 51903Unread post GEEKKCC
Thu Dec 13, 2018 10:25 pm

Hi Trolls and friends, i bought the vinyl recorder from Souri 4 months ago.

Great machine and a great man, everything was great until we moved studio space and then we encountered a humming sound from the Amplifier from souri, so we decided to change the plug into several different 13amp mains sockets around the room, somewhere better and some were worse, however, there is a slight hum when you turn the amp on when cutting with no music, turn off the amp it sounds fine and clean. I have a few questions as a noob and need to work out a few things.

1. SOURIS MIXER VOLUME AND GAIN IS CONTROLLED BY THE PFL AND THE CHANNEL 2 FADER, I CAN NOT FIND THE BALANCE RIGHT UNLESS I HAVE THE PFL KNOB REALLY LOW (WHICH DAMPENS THE HUM AND GETS RID OF IT ALMOST) BUT THEN THE CUTS ARE REALLY LOW AND IF I WAS TO TURN THE GAIN UP THROUGH THE FADER IT WILL DISTORT and sound bad.

2. BAD FREQUENCY ISSUES WITH HIGHS AND BRIGHTNESS, WE GO FROM DIGITAL TO POLY AND POLY THERE IS A LACK OF HIGHS AND PUNCH, ITS VERY DARK AND NOT WELL ROUNDED. Why could this be?

3. GROUNDING LOOP OR WRONG ROUTINE OR STYLUS ISSUES (EVEN THOUGH HAVE A BRAND NEW NEEDLE)

4. THE MACHINE WAS PERFECT BEFORE CHANGING A FEW PHONOS FOR THE BETTER

PLEASE HELP
THANKS

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Makito
Posts: 4
Joined: Thu Oct 11, 2018 4:26 am

Re: vertical treble issues on T560?

Post: # 51916Unread post Makito
Sun Dec 16, 2018 6:28 am

@GEEKKCC

Get rid of Souri's mixer, I think it is a weak spot in T560 setup.
Almost every user here has their own modification of the machine
and the first thing is always removing that cheap little mixer
Read this helpful forum from the beginning and also do a little search
on social networks-instagram for example and you will find
many users from here with pictures of their setups-that was,at least
for me,the best way to get an idea what i should do

Before I went to Germany Souri sent me one 12 inch with a song of my
choice,which he cut himself-sound was,as you say dark and with no
punch at all,so every time you cut vinyl from digital sources
you must do a little EQ preparation of the files,especially if you
are using Souri's guidelines and default sound settings.
People often think if they buy lossless file from digital stores
it will sound perfect on a vinyl,but unfortunately this is not true
due to limitations of vinyl technology

Good thing to try is Myshank stylus 340S and blanks- with a well mastered file
you will not believe the results, especially if you like me
playing vinyl in a club environment with big sound systems

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MEGAMIKE
Posts: 395
Joined: Thu Feb 21, 2008 6:56 am
Location: west coast Australia

Re: vertical treble issues on T560?

Post: # 51955Unread post MEGAMIKE
Sun Dec 23, 2018 9:30 pm

Don't buy anything from my shank if you are still down with souri . The diamonds and blanks are no better just way more expensive ..

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Museum Music
Posts: 5
Joined: Sun May 22, 2016 2:24 pm

Re: vertical treble issues on T560?

Post: # 51956Unread post Museum Music
Mon Dec 24, 2018 7:14 am

GEEKKS I would change the power/cutting up after removing the mixer.

And I would pay 10€ if all information about T560 could be in one place like a sub forum called the secret society of Souri's brothers and children.


Envoyé de mon iPhone en utilisant Tapatalk

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Museum Music
Posts: 5
Joined: Sun May 22, 2016 2:24 pm

Re: vertical treble issues on T560?

Post: # 51957Unread post Museum Music
Mon Dec 24, 2018 7:15 am

*power /cutting amp


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RedSpadeRobyn
Posts: 25
Joined: Sat Dec 16, 2017 2:55 pm

Re: vertical treble issues on T560?

Post: # 52301Unread post RedSpadeRobyn
Tue Feb 05, 2019 5:17 pm

+1000000
Museum Music wrote:GEEKKS I would change the power/cutting up after removing the mixer.

And I would pay 10€ if all information about T560 could be in one place like a sub forum called the secret society of Souri's brothers and children.


Envoyé de mon iPhone en utilisant Tapatalk

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kodymonroe
Posts: 6
Joined: Tue Nov 02, 2021 1:15 am

Re: vertical treble issues on T560?

Post: # 62846Unread post kodymonroe
Thu May 04, 2023 3:51 am

did you ever resolve this pal?

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