- FFrankensteinRecords
- Posts: 43
- Joined: Thu May 17, 2012 7:26 pm
- Location: United States
- Contact:
Who knows a good machinist? (Microfusion Book Type Molds)
Hey guys, as the title suggests I'm looking for a good machinist (...I think).
Basically I'm trying to find someone that can make some simplified book type molds for the microfusion pressing process.
This is a proven process of vinyl manufacture that uses electrically heated presses of much smaller capacity than current traditional presses.
This is made possible by using pulverized or powdered PVC spread evenly across the stamper instead of the traditional puck.
This process was used to make hundreds of thousands of records back in the day by the Cook record company.
Markrob conducted some DIY tests of this method a while back to some success. I plan on taking it a step further with an industrial heated platen press and a proper book type mold.
I've been quoted about $6000 for a new 7" book type mold of the style used for Finebilt presses. These have thick walls that are routed for traditional steam heat and water cooling (which is not necessary for my purposes) and I believe it may affect the heat transfer from platen into mold, therefore I'm reluctant to spend nearly twice what I'm spending on the press itself for something that is essentially overkill.
I have very limited knowledge of machining, therefore I don't know how much it would cost to have a custom simplified book type mold made, but I figured it would be worth seeing if I can do it under 6 grand.
So please my fellow trolls, enlighten me. If you know a good machinist, or if you know where I can get a used Finebilt mold.
Basically I'm trying to find someone that can make some simplified book type molds for the microfusion pressing process.
This is a proven process of vinyl manufacture that uses electrically heated presses of much smaller capacity than current traditional presses.
This is made possible by using pulverized or powdered PVC spread evenly across the stamper instead of the traditional puck.
This process was used to make hundreds of thousands of records back in the day by the Cook record company.
Markrob conducted some DIY tests of this method a while back to some success. I plan on taking it a step further with an industrial heated platen press and a proper book type mold.
I've been quoted about $6000 for a new 7" book type mold of the style used for Finebilt presses. These have thick walls that are routed for traditional steam heat and water cooling (which is not necessary for my purposes) and I believe it may affect the heat transfer from platen into mold, therefore I'm reluctant to spend nearly twice what I'm spending on the press itself for something that is essentially overkill.
I have very limited knowledge of machining, therefore I don't know how much it would cost to have a custom simplified book type mold made, but I figured it would be worth seeing if I can do it under 6 grand.
So please my fellow trolls, enlighten me. If you know a good machinist, or if you know where I can get a used Finebilt mold.
- ROLANDJAYS
- Posts: 287
- Joined: Sun Apr 14, 2013 3:48 am
Re: Who knows a good machinist? (Microfusion Book Type Molds
The price depends on how your parts are designed.
Do you have blueprints ?
Do you have models?
how tight are the tolerances ?
What type of materials are you using?
What are the quantities?
What is the lead time?
These are questions you should already have answers to before you look for a machinist.
Do you have blueprints ?
Do you have models?
how tight are the tolerances ?
What type of materials are you using?
What are the quantities?
What is the lead time?
These are questions you should already have answers to before you look for a machinist.
- FFrankensteinRecords
- Posts: 43
- Joined: Thu May 17, 2012 7:26 pm
- Location: United States
- Contact:
Re: Who knows a good machinist? (Microfusion Book Type Molds
I don't have proper blueprints or models, the closets I have are the drawings and diagrams included in the original patent.
I don't really know regarding tolerances, but I imagine they have to be pretty tight for perfect alignment of the stampers.
The original patent identifies the walls as being magnesium alloy of less than 1/4" to facilitate heat transfer.
At first I'm only lookjng for 1 or possibly 2 for the purpose of experimenting and working out the revised process. If everything goes well I would potentially need them on a continual sort of basis, or atleast several at a time.
I'm not in a hurry, so lead time shouldn't be a problem.
I figure it shouldn't be too complicated, it's essentially 2 sheets of metal hinged together that can accept modern stampers, align when closed, and stop at the desired thickness of .06"
I don't really know regarding tolerances, but I imagine they have to be pretty tight for perfect alignment of the stampers.
The original patent identifies the walls as being magnesium alloy of less than 1/4" to facilitate heat transfer.
At first I'm only lookjng for 1 or possibly 2 for the purpose of experimenting and working out the revised process. If everything goes well I would potentially need them on a continual sort of basis, or atleast several at a time.
I'm not in a hurry, so lead time shouldn't be a problem.
I figure it shouldn't be too complicated, it's essentially 2 sheets of metal hinged together that can accept modern stampers, align when closed, and stop at the desired thickness of .06"
Re: Who knows a good machinist? (Microfusion Book Type Molds
in theory is very simple. But steel and work rates are expensive. There is so much detail to it that you should spend more than that....i guess.
- ROLANDJAYS
- Posts: 287
- Joined: Sun Apr 14, 2013 3:48 am
Re: Who knows a good machinist? (Microfusion Book Type Molds
If you want to save money and get what you want, you need to come up with a design. Or nobody will know what you want .
or spend a lot of money and have someone else figure it out for you.
or spend a lot of money and have someone else figure it out for you.
Re: Who knows a good machinist? (Microfusion Book Type Molds
Hello all here and Mr Cook He He
If you get yourself a used stamper, it will have the shape of the mould that it used on
Trace it out from the back and get two plates machined out of forged aluminium
They can be placed on a four post die set which can be obtained at a very low cost used, than you can experiment away
I suggest that the die set you want should have a round hole in its base and the top plate
The machinist can than allow for a spigot at the bottom of the machined halves so as to locate them to the die set
Than bolt them down on the plates with Allen screws quite a common way of holding moulds on a press
That should suffice for what you are doing at this stage the aluminium will be fine for 7" records
It will last for many many thousands at around the 75 tonne closing pressure which is what it takes
Don't worry to much about holding the perimeter of the stampers, you can glue them on the moulds
So long you get yourself a set of center bushes and pins that will give you the dimensions of the center hole for the machinist
Here is a what a die set looks like
https://encrypted-tbn3.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcQMGZrGjohDYqmWwpz_N2pHr1VNgaUxAlB7f8ZlOj-03TPypAUB
I am sure if you go around any decent used machinery dealer who specialises in presses he most likely have one to sell you
They are not that dear new to start off with
I guess your press will be a four post kind that should be fine
You need to think about the pins as they need to pop out so you can place your labels but that's for another time
Best of luck
Cheers
If you get yourself a used stamper, it will have the shape of the mould that it used on
Trace it out from the back and get two plates machined out of forged aluminium
They can be placed on a four post die set which can be obtained at a very low cost used, than you can experiment away
I suggest that the die set you want should have a round hole in its base and the top plate
The machinist can than allow for a spigot at the bottom of the machined halves so as to locate them to the die set
Than bolt them down on the plates with Allen screws quite a common way of holding moulds on a press
That should suffice for what you are doing at this stage the aluminium will be fine for 7" records
It will last for many many thousands at around the 75 tonne closing pressure which is what it takes
Don't worry to much about holding the perimeter of the stampers, you can glue them on the moulds
So long you get yourself a set of center bushes and pins that will give you the dimensions of the center hole for the machinist
Here is a what a die set looks like
https://encrypted-tbn3.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcQMGZrGjohDYqmWwpz_N2pHr1VNgaUxAlB7f8ZlOj-03TPypAUB
I am sure if you go around any decent used machinery dealer who specialises in presses he most likely have one to sell you
They are not that dear new to start off with
I guess your press will be a four post kind that should be fine
You need to think about the pins as they need to pop out so you can place your labels but that's for another time
Best of luck
Cheers
"The Vinyl Truth"
Chris
Chris
- ROLANDJAYS
- Posts: 287
- Joined: Sun Apr 14, 2013 3:48 am
Re: Who knows a good machinist? (Microfusion Book Type Molds
I have some book molds I'm not using.
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Re: Who knows a good machinist? (Microfusion Book Type Molds
They will do. Cheers
"The Vinyl Truth"
Chris
Chris