Xertz Records

[Xertz]

Hi Everyone.
I'm Otto Dean, a 13 year old vinyl lover. I love this community and everyone on it. That being said, I want to share my new project: Xertz Records. If funded, this project will help bring short run, hi-fi, vinyl record creation to artists via lathe cutting. I've done tons and tons of research, mostly on this forum. If you want to check it out go to: https://www.indiegogo.com/projects/xertz-records-vinyl-any-musican-can-afford-band#/ .

P.S. I have another account with many posts on it, however I would like to keep that secret for various reasons. If any you know/figure out what my separate account is, it is important to me that you don't share it.


Thanks for reading!

[piaptk]

Have you been in touch with souri and are 100% sure he will sell you a lathe?

I've seen at least 2 other kick starters that either couldn't buy one from him, or did, and then blew a head, couldn't afford needles, whatever and left their backers high and dry.

[rsimms3]

I applaud your enthusiasm! I think it's great that you have created your own record label and are looking for ways to further the distribution methods of your bands and have a desire to take the next step creatively. With that being said, I would ask if you have a business plan/model related to this endeavor. You indicate you will offer "high quality, low quantity affordable records". How will you do this? How will your service be better/different than other services/people that offer a similar product? If you haven't spoken directly with others in this space such as Mike above, then I fear your research is incomplete. I speak purely as a hobbyist cutter but also as a humble observer over the past several years here at the board. Many folks have come and gone with the exact same idea that you have proposed here with little/no success. No matter what happens, I wish you luck.

[Xertz]

I've talked to Souri before, although I didn't mention my age. I don't see why he wouldn't sell me or my parents a lathe.

[markrob]

Hi,

Are you prepared to go to Germany for training?

[Xertz]

In response to rsimms3's question: Because I am a kid, and I don't need money (although I want some), I don't need to profit a ton from this, plus I don't have to pay for a cutter with my own money. I have researched all of the costs of record cutting, and I have found the cheapest priced supplies to use that produce good results.

Here is an example of some of the profit I could make, and how much it would cost for the band/artist:
12" Record:
Record Blank(s) (bought in packs to save money): $1.00 - 2.00
Turtle Wax: <1.00
-----------------------
Cost: $1 - 2

If I sell it to the band/artist for $7, I get around $6. Pretty good pay for a 13 year old, and a good price for the artist.

In response to Mark's question: I have ton tons of research on Expedia, Skiplagged etc for everything from plane costs to car rental costs. If Souri does not let me take the training in Germany, my dad says he is happy to go there and pass on the information to me. He is a pretty knowledgeable guy on vinyl records and whatnot.

[audiosteam]

Spotted you but I'll keep it secret.

I'd love to help you, I would definitely invite you if you would be in my area, do you have anyone around you cutting records, this is how I started, visiting a friend who had a lathe. Do that if you haven't done it.

You can add a few lines to your calculation:

Total starting investment - temporary line until you get it cleared

Permanent lines
styli + resharpening+ shipping - (you need to know how many records you can cut until resharpening or changing the stylus with your setup then you can add it to the price / record)
workforce - how much do you take per hour?
labels, sleeves and printing
taxes
shipping to customers
customs if you buy stuff overseas

Money may not be a primary concern at your age but for many of us it's our job.. I don't think it's healthy to base your business plan on the fact that you don't need to earn money. No one is making big bucks out of this, there's no point into dumping. Why not coming up with some fresh ideas that could add value to your offer? This is also something that could have a positive impact on your crowdfunding campaign.

Personal feedback: For the campaign I would rather talk about your love, music and your passion, the motivations and what you can offer as a newcomer with fresh ideas. Change your angle, the dumping attack is not good at all..

"This kid is about to to change vinyl record production for small artists."
This kind of titles are good for boosting clicks on YT but not for raising funds.

Also what makes you think that musicians cannot afford records? Introduce yourself and make something more intimate, don't use images or videos that you don't own.

Peace

[Gridlock]

If you're into it at this age don't ever stop. When I was your age I made my own using a speaker and a sewing needle. The late great Les Paul made his first lathe out of garbage at age 13. Learn the science before you make an investment but if souri will train you GO FOR IT. from what I hear he's pretty picky (i.e. star wars: he is too old to begin the training) but just absorb everything and start thinking in advance of ways to circumvent problems diy. Rock on

[piaptk]

The reason souri might not sell you a lathe isn't your age, it's the fact that he is Souri. Search him on the forum and find MANY cases of him ghosting people. That being said your age will probably work in your favor if you and a parent both go to Germany to train with him (the only way he will sell you one).

Also, don't forget to factor in needle cost to your calculation.

And if you tell souri you aren't gonna buy his blanks and ship them from Germany (which will cost way more than $1 a piece, he won't sell to you.

[piaptk]

Where did you find 12" blanks for $1-2 including shipping to you? I will tell you right now, as someone whose studio has had probably close to 100,000 lathe cuts made in it over the last ten years, that it is not even remotely in a realistic ballpark.

Even if that was the case and you sold them for $7, you can only make about 1 Lp an hour with audio setup, test cuts, dividing your dropped chip reject discs (not to mention the cost of those discs)... so even if you DID get a $1 blank (please tell me where that is) you are still only making $6/hr not counting needle wear, and a million other factors.

Trust me. There is WAY more to all of this than you've put in your formula.

good luck, but be ready for a trial by fire and you've gotta be flexible and ready to pivot, because things will NOT be easy or go as you currently plan.

[piaptk]

All this reality checking aside. Good for you hustling for what you want.

You obviously have a lot more going on than most 19 year olds, let alone 13 year olds, so I believe that you will definitely figure it out.

But in order to have a solid head start, pay close attention to EVERY piece of advice on this thread, and use it as a jumping off point for more research. It will make the inevitable shock of practical reality a lot easier to ride.

DM me for my number if you want $10,000 worth of free advice on mistakes to NOT make (and a thing or two that DOES work).

[Xertz]

(This part is all in response to gridlocks questions/comments)
I am yet to personally meet anyone with a working record lathe, besides the people at Third Man Records in Detroit (although I wish I had).

I already thought about stylus resharpening cost and whatnot. My Indiegogo money goal is to raise $8,000+, so I have more then enough money for replacements. Workforce costs would just be how much money would be left after expenses. Taxes don't effect the price too much.

I forgot to mention printing, labels, sleeves in my original quote thingy. Sleeves, after a quick look on Amazon cost $24 for a pack of 100. Divide that into 100 and you get $0.24 per record. Not a bad price. Found some blank record labels, costs $4 for 80. Printer ink shouldn't be a big deal. Shipping will be paid by the customers. The only thing i'm going to buy overseas is record blanks and stuff from Souri. It's hard to calculate what that might cost, but I think it wouldn't be to much compared to the cost of what i'm buying.

I agree with Gridlock about the title of the YouTube video, it is a bit cheesy. I might change it. I might also change some of the text in the campaign as well after I get a second opinion. The one thing I won't change is the video. It took me forever to edit the whole thing. Even just recording the audio took three sessions (mainly because of edits to the script), and I don't want to deal with that again.

Piaptk:
The way you can get blanks at around $1, is if you buy them in packs of 50-100 from My Shank or a similar site with cheap prices. I'm PMing you. (You were awesome on The White Rabbit Project BTW).

[handcut]

Hi,

First of all - good luck to you. One of the best things about getting a VR is the trip to Germany. Enjoy it.

Second - go over your prices with a fine-toothed comb. If you have to estimate, over-estimate. Don't forget to factor in things like shipping costs, taxes and surcharges, especially with PayPal etc. As has already been mentioned, you are not getting blanks for $1 a pop. No way. Have another look at those prices. Factor in waste also - you will waste a lot of blanks, especially in the beginning.

[rsimms3]

Piaptk:
The way you can get blanks at around $1, is if you buy them in packs of 50-100 from My Shank or a similar site with cheap prices. I'm PMing you. (You were awesome on The White Rabbit Project BTW).

You must be getting some sort of sweet heart deal, I just checked pricing over on MyShank and I couldn't get to any price point below $5 each for 12" blanks and that was using the bulk 100 piece pricing. Shipping was 2/3 the cost of the blanks themselves (rightly so given I live in the States).

Again, I would recommend a business plan. Not needing money means nothing in the end. Maybe if you're rich, but you aren't by any means by your own admission.

Cutter - $3131 PLUS SHIPPING (excludes the 19% VAT that you won't pay)
Import duty - ? unclear if this will be a cost
Blanks (Souri) - 39 euro per 10 or $4.70 each or $470 per 100 PLUS SHIPPING
Stylus - $235 each PLUS SHIPPING (extra, package comes with one)

Ballpark costs
Turntable - $400
Plane ticket(s) to Germany - $500 each
Lodging - $300 each
Food - $100 each
Incidentals - $200 each
Sleeves for 100 records - $175

All that adds up to about $5500 leaving you with $2500 to play with in terms of waste, repurchasing supplies, etc. You will ruin a cutting stylus. You will ruin blanks along the way learning or adjusting the system.

So, putting aside the $2500 for a moment. If you have an overhead cost of $6 per disc ($5 for the disc plus $1 for sleeves) and sell them to the artist for $7 each you have to sell 6 records in order to buy a single blank disc/sleeves for your next run. Sure, using your seed money to buy supplies will allow you to provide a cheaper price in the beginning but at some point raw material costs catch up to production numbers which means a required adjustment to the final cost to the band.

This all hinges on Souri agreeing to sell a system to you.

[andybee]

my name is andy, I am 3 years old, I want a VMS-80.
please give me the money...
sorry folks , I think, this is a fake, maybe from the father of the 13year old boy?
you can also see the "joana" lathe in the video.
I think, this forum is full of lurkers and fakers, so be aware!
maybe I am wrong... I don´t care

[piaptk]

my name is andy, I am 3 years old, I want a VMS-80.
please give me the money...
sorry folks , I think, this is a fake, maybe from the father of the 13year old boy?
you can also see the "joana" lathe in the video.
I think, this forum is full of lurkers and fakers, so be aware!
maybe I am wrong... I don´t care

No, this is legit. The "Joanna lathe" in the video is just one of many stock images of he found on the internet and dropped into the video.

[llaryllama]

Hi Otto

Just wanted to share some encouragement. I started my business a year older than you (14) with nothing but a dream and time on my hands. That was over 20 years ago and now I own two factories with a few dozen staff. I will tell you right now it's damn hard work but if you are anything like me there is just no way you could do anything else with your life.

It was very slow going at first with a lot of setbacks but each time you screw up and keep going you end up a little bit smarter and already ahead of most people who just give up.

When I started out there was no money from family, no kickstarter or anything like that. I started out brokering small jobs for local clients and basically doing any paying job I could find to save money. While getting my first studio off the ground I worked as an electrician's apprentice, telco installer, computer repairman, plasterer, builder and delivered newspapers on a Sunday morning. I saved enough to rent an office which helped the business look more serious and able to take on bigger jobs, then gradually started buying up very simple second hand machinery for the manufacturing side until I no longer had to rely on outside suppliers.

You don't have to invest $8k in a lathe to get something going. Find someone reasonably local who has a lathe but not enough business. Do your homework and find out how to get thinks like quality labels, jackets etc. made at a good price. Find lazy customers with money who want someone else to do all the work for them and offer a one stop service for local artists. Get your music on vinyl, 20 copies fully packaged for $x. This will let you learn a great deal about the business without much money up front and as you start to build up funds and experience you can look into buying equipment you need to do things in-house.

[Xertz]

Thanks, will do