Vacuums for chip-sucking

[grooveguy]

A lot of posts on these pages reflect a good deal of agony over chip (swarf) removal. Solutions range from DustBusters and shop vacs to very expensive positive-displacement laboratory/medical pumps.

I've been using a multistage Ametek Lamb pump for years, something salvaged from a contractor-grade shop vacuum. I put it in a carpet-lined plywood box like this:

Vacuum Pump Enclosure.jpg

and run it off about 60-80VAC using a transformer with the 40V secondary wired out-of-phase with the AC mains to subtract from the 120V. These vacuums are not meant for continuous duty and will overheat, especially if the air input is constricted down to a 3/8-inch tube to the lathe. But under-voltaged they'll run comfortably seemingly forever and still have plenty of suction.

Just for fun, I put "vacuum motor" into eBay and found exactly the same thing I've been using. These in particular are meant for 'whole-house' centralized vacuum systems, and the price here for a brand new motor is not nearly as offputting as what some Trolls have admitted to spending.

Snap1.jpg

Another possibility is the 'blower' out of a 1950s/1960s vintage Magnus Chord Organ, the little plastic reed organs that sold for $20 or so new back when kids were more easily amused than they are today. Those moved a lot of air and with sufficient pressure that holding down several keys at once didn't compromise the sweet(?) sound.

I'm just bringing this up because I read a posting here today where a Troll spent about $150 for a lab-grade 'pump,' only to find that it didn't have quite the performance he was hoping for; probably plenty of psi but not enough throughput ('amps' but no 'volts').

[boryo]

Thanks for posting the link!
It would be great if you make a review after some time of use.

Best,
Bob

[grooveguy]

I believe I posted previously that I burned-up my mom's cannister-type vacuum cleaner, some 60+ years ago with my recording activities. One bad thing about most household vacuums, DustBusters, etc., is that they are not made for continuous use, and if you restrict the airflow volume they overheat. These 'robot vacuums,' on the other hand, are made to work over long periods of time, moving around the house at their leisure, so one of these might well suck swarf nicely. Doubtless you can replace the battery with a mains DC supply. Do let us know how it works out. The fact that it's quiet is a real plus. Rather expensive, however.

[Deke Dickerson]

Paul at Aardvark Mastering in Denver hipped me to using player piano vacuum pumps for chip sucking.

They are kind of perfect--low noise, not too much vacuum, and you can get models with adjustable motor speed to suit your taste.

They are a few hundred bucks but for me it seemed like a good way to just be done with this issue.

You can find them on ebay or online through a few sources googling "player piano vacuum pump."

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Player-Piano-Electric-Vacuum-Motor-Suction-Box-Electrify-it-SS0-120-/292102095985

Deke

[boryo]

Paul at Aardvark Mastering in Denver hipped me to using player piano vacuum pumps for chip sucking ....... https://www.ebay.com/itm/Player-Piano-Electric-Vacuum-Motor-Suction-Box-Electrify-it-SS0-120-/292102095985

Deke

Thank you Deke! Do you have an idea if this is going to work for plastic chip suction?

[punkrock]

Hi, I used The vacuum I got from Souri (was it a Thomas?) until it died last year. Probably cut around 800 records with it. I had no idea of what to buy, doubted between a fish tank pump and an industrial type vacuum. But again, no idea which pump would be suitable...
Then, while visiting the local dumpster to get rid of stuff, I saw a Nilfisk vacuum in one of the containers, I think it was a GM 80 classic. Knowing these are the Rolls Royce of vacuums, I asked for it and got it for free. Took it home, cleant it and tried it... it worked! Been using it for the last 200 records, no problems at all. So powerful I had to drill some holes in the hose. I really feared it could suck the cutting stylus! No noise problems, it’s quite silent plus I have it in another room.

[grooveguy]

Wow, punkrock, thanks for that info. I was not familiar with those vacuums, but went to their Website and was immediately impressed. That type of industrial vacuum is exactly what you want to use, if you are lucky enough to get one. A friend who is into woodworking has a central vacuum system hooked to his saws, planers, etc., and it looks very much like these, except his is classed as a 'dust collector' specifically for shop use. Anything meant to run continuously should be great, just avoid motors with brushes, which tend to burn themselves up if the airflow is restricted.

[symatic]

any reason why this wouldn't work?

those big shop vacuums like the nilfisk seem to be pretty noisy....

https://www.instructables.com/id/How-to-Make-a-Powerful-Vacuum-Cleaner/

[grooveguy]

Might work, but probably about as well as a DirtDevil or similar hand-held utility vacuum. The "high speed motor" would probably not last a long time, and you'd have to insulate against noise. Again, vacuums like this (and the DirtDevil) are most efficient pulling a good amount of air through them, not with the inlet whittled-down to a quarter-inch or whatever. You've got a choice of a single impeller running really fast, or a multistage blower at a more modest speed. Most all 'pressure' applications (moving very little air, or none at all) will use the latter. Done properly, cascading a bunch of computer-type cooling fans in series ought to work, but not the way I tired it, simply bolting them together. You need an expansion chamber of some sort between stages.

[Lotus503]

I'm looking at a Gravograph Compact Chip Collector from an engraving system for my Presto 6N. Anybody have any experience with one of these? Here's the link to the Gravograph website: http://www.directindustry.com/prod/gravograph/product-8044-1852294.html

[grooveguy]

Looks interesting, but I note that the literature states, "...stops between engravings to limit noise." That suggests to me a high speed, 'universal' motor like a home vacuum cleaner, not meant for continuous use... and it would have to be soundproofed. What do these things cost? Any seller who invites, "call for quote" sounds expensive.