Deep Grooves Mastering - 320 Style Diamond Dub Test

[opcode66]

My competition has asked that I provide evidence of my claims. Herein you will find a well documented demonstration of my diamond cutting styli. You'll note that I've now provided more documentation of my product than DCS (The Shank) or Vinylike.de (Vinylium is dead).

On the website for DCS (The Shank) you will find a Dub Test. http://www.diamond-cutting-stylus.com/audio-test/. The actual track is shared on ChirBit here http://chirb.it/wp/mPvHyt. This is the best foot forward sample of audio that The Shank himself has provided to the world of cutters. So, to be fair, I've selected the same track for my dub cut test. As you can read, The Shank performed his test on a GRAMPIAN lathe recorder with vinylium system ( sc99/vc200 ).

I identified the track as In the Deathcar (feat. Iggy Pop) by Goran Bregovic using the Shazam iPhone application. I purchased the track from iTunes and set it up to cut. I used vanilla settings all the way through. I cut on my VMS 70 with SX74 cutterhead (VB74B Amp Rack) and Deep Grooves Mastering 320 Style Diamond Cutting Stylus available at http://www.deepgroovesmastering.com/store.aspx. I've posted my version of the same 2 minute clip to ChiBit http://chirb.it/yO65mF. I used a Technics SL-1200MK2 with Shure M97xE Audiophile cartridge and an Art Dj Pre II to perform the playback rip. I also ripped with an Ortofon Blue, but liked the Shure rip better. I gained my rip to match the one from The Shank for a true comparison.

You can download both my MP3 clip as well as the one from The Shank here http://www.deepgroovesmastering.com/share/DGM_and_DCS_Dub_Test.zip. They are both MP3 encoded at constant 128 kbps. I made mine exactly the same audio fidelity as his so no one can cry foul. Please download and analyze at your leisure. I can supply the full 5 minute wave file to anyone who wants it.

Additionally, for your viewing pleasure, I've created a video that consists of still shots of me doing the actual cut in question edited together with video of the cut and rip. There is also information at the end about what was used for cutting and ripping. The background music is the rip itself, including the lead out and locked groove at the end that I let go for a few revolutions.

I invite you, the viewing audience, to please draw your own conclusions. We now stock Long Shank Presto Cutting Diamonds with heater wires. As always, we appreciate your interest!

Look for more creative products from Deep Grooves Mastering in 2014. We will also be releasing a professionally filmed and editied video guide to cutting plastic.

The edited video

A Clip of the Cutting

And, a clip of the Orotofon Blue Playback Rip

Some pictures of the stylus and cutting:

[opcode66]

More Pictures:

[flozki]

thanks.
the groove picture looks already great.
will listen to that today...

but once again. for all those tests.for anyone.
it would be great to get a minimum of standard for all the cutting tests..

- use a WAV/AIFF uncompressed 44100 Hz 24bit audio file. a 128kbit mp3 is just horrible.

- put in the beginning of the test track a 1 kHz 5cm/s (8cm/s is already not trackable distortion free with most pickups) tone of 10-20 seconds.. and then cut in relation to that tone.
that would help to adjust same levels. also we know where we are. and we can verify if playback needle is somehow adjusted to a minimum...

- would be great if we can agree on 2-3 creative commons, licensed free tracks in good quality to judge sound. some acoustic, some electronics
of yes we take well produced stuff . its only snippets so 10-20 seconds should not be a problem. but if pubilished on youtube, soundcloud etc. that could cause some troubles.



also shank should provide same test on a laquer. or opcode into vinyl.
shank he did his cut into a pressed vinyl record. which is way different from a laquer.

but i think its super interesting to have those tests....

[The Shank]

Question : Where have you seen that DCS is MyShank? We know him very well, but we are not DCS. DCS is http://www.lesanneesvinyls.fr/
Some of his stylus are ours but some are not ^^

It's like saying Vinylike is Vinylium...

Opcode, I have no doubt you are a real vinyl fanatic, that's a good thing, but please, check your sources before posting (once again).

Your test is interessting yes I will ask a friend in Paris, working on a VMS70 system to make some test. A real test is done with the same cutting system...right?

[flozki]

steven
i think you dont have to hide.... hehe.

i am quite impressed with the results of those two systems...
i woul dbe happy to do such silent cuts into vinyl... never reached such low levels myself.

especially if we know that the DSC cut is done into vinyl not into laquers..
and if we remember the small details of general setup..(68W power for VC200 per channel instead of 550W SAL74B)
so i say wow!

and i am pretty sure that there is no big audible difference between all of those styli if geometry is the same and all cut the same material.

[The Shank]

steven
i think you dont have to hide.... hehe.

He's the guy who bought my cutting system few years ago : nothing to hide

http://www.whois.com/whois/lesanneesvinyls.fr
http://www.whois.com/whois/diamond-cutting-stylus.com

Jerome is good friend, but definitely independant of what we do here ^^

For the test, I will ask Hervé from DK mastering to make some cuts. We did some few years ago with Yann and his brother, it was pretty funny.

[opcode66]

it would be great to get a minimum of standard for all the cutting tests..

I agree totally. I figured a good place to start was to matching what was already out there.

- use a WAV/AIFF uncompressed 44100 Hz 24bit audio file. a 128kbit mp3 is just horrible.

Again, just matching what was already presented. I'm happy to cut another test. I can also provide 44.1/16bit WAV to anyone who wants it. You too Flo.

- put in the beginning of the test track a 1 kHz 5cm/s (8cm/s is already not trackable distortion free with most pickups) tone of 10-20 seconds..

My thoughts exactly. So, we'll do this next.

- would be great if we can agree on 2-3 creative commons, licensed free tracks in good quality to judge sound. some acoustic, some electronics
of yes we take well produced stuff . its only snippets so 10-20 seconds should not be a problem. but if pubilished on youtube, soundcloud etc. that could cause some troubles.

All you have to do is click a checkbox on Youtube saying that the audio is licensed and you know this. I had to do that for the video I posted because youtube identified the music.

also shank should provide same test on a laquer. or opcode into vinyl.

I wasn't cutting lacquer... I was cutting into Makrolon. Black polycarbonate. You'll notice, no offset hole (as all lacquers have). Also, you'll notice the thickness of the disc in the shots of the cutterhead above. You can almost see the layers... And, the right angle edge. I don't usually run a blade around the edge like Souri does to get rid of the squared edge. I leave mine squared. That is polycarb....

shank he did his cut into a pressed vinyl record. which is way different from a laquer.

Yup, but not much different from Makrolon, which is what I cut into.

but i think its super interesting to have those tests....

More to come.

[opcode66]

if we know that the DSC cut is done into vinyl not into laquers..

That is not a lacquer. I can shoot a video of me bending the disc if required to prove this is Makrolon. Better yet, give me an address Flo. I'll send it to you.

and i am pretty sure that there is no big audible difference between all of those styli if geometry is the same and all cut the same material.

If the tip is not ground right then there will be background noise in your first cut. There would be an audible difference. BG noise and scratchy sounding audio. So, I can't agree with this.

[opcode66]

Question : Where have you seen that DCS is MyShank? We know him very well, but we are not DCS. DCS is http://www.lesanneesvinyls.fr/

He stocks your product. Therein lies my confusion. Sorry about that. A detail I really don't care about. But, I understand that you want to make that distinction.

A proper analogy would be Indimant is not Vinylike..... Not Vinylike is not Vinylium....
Indimant stocks Vinylike but is not vinylike. You stock DCS but you are not DCS. Vinylike never stocked vinylium.

Anyway, I'm happy to make whatever tests are asked of me to make. I am cutting into Bayer Makrolon. Unless you provide me with some other pressed disc...

Cheers!

[opcode66]

So, here we have the evidence. Polycarbonate. Not Lacquer.

[flozki]

yes great i did not not notice its in polycarbonate.
i was pretty sure that i read on one of the pictures that you did cutting into laquer.
but anyway so we then can almost compare. i personally had always hard time to cut into pressed PVC records.
never got that good results as in polycarbonate.

so then looking forward for all the next tests.
for me its not only the diamond, the blanks but also the whole system..
if someone with a vinylrecorder will do it too.super interesting.

for testtrack i uploaded long ago some testtrack.
i even forget often that i did that once.
with the 1k tone some additional frequencies.
http://www.floka.com/caruso/lathetrolls_test.wav
also it had left, right 1k tones. so we can also get an idea about channel separation, crosstalk
the music is not my favorite. but it has most you need in terms of frequencies.
its one of the tracks we used at vinylium for head checks (nice curent peaks on an SAL74 )after light beam pattern and other
but voice is missing and so we should expand that test track with more sound snippets.
this track is not the ultimate thing. i will think about a better one. also difference tones 315,3150 hz would be good to insert.

so we could define something right now.
i suggest. the one i wanted to do longt time for my own test purposes...

band1
1 kHz 0db, full scale (cut on the laquer at 5cm/s) 15s
1 kHz -10 dB mono 10s
1 kHz -10 dB left 10s
1 kHz -10 dB right 10s
315 Hz & 3150 Hz 15s
band2
15000 Hz -20db 10s
10000 Hz -20db 10s
5000 Hz -20db 10s
3150 Hz -10 dB 10s
315 Hz -10dB 10s
100 Hz -10dB 10s
band3
electronic music -6dB, 300 Hz elliptical EQ ( so people dont have to use hf limiters and other stuff.direct cut 30s
band4
jazz or folk -6dB, 300 Hz eliptical EQ 30s

total of 4min. thats around 60 MB for 44100 Hz and 24 bit.


a goal would be to get sounds of all the diy heads we see pictures here.
sure they never beat an sx74. but I (and i guess most here on the list)
love to see how far you can go with a diy solution and to have a true comparison no matter what.

[opcode66]

Downloaded. Would you like a 33.3 RPM cut or 45 RPM? My vote is for 45 RPM. I cut into Polycarbonate until supplied with other pressed blanks from you.

[Tony]

Thanks for the info. It's good to see some public spirited effort is being made to show what's on offer here. Specs as diligent as 'Ultra long life' and 'best sound' is what we have to suffer here in Europe... I would be interested to give this one a try. Can you ship to APO boxes?

[tragwag]

Thanks for the info. It's good to see some public spirited effort is being made to show what's on offer here. Specs as diligent as 'Ultra long life' and 'best sound' is what we have to suffer here in Europe... I would be interested to give this one a try. Can you ship to APO boxes?

hey Tony, Opcode66 hasn't been on the forum for a while - you can follow him through his website here: http://deepgroovesmastering.com/
I'm not following super closely so I may have missed it, but I don't believe he's offering diamond stylus at the moment.