Sale stylus ruby, sapphire $ 15

[alexsation]

I advise you to buy a needle №1 or №2, these the needles have
specific cut to the mounting screw shank rested his and not spun on its axis. Needle №3 and №4 have a round shank, makes all the difference.

[tragwag]

my 2 stylus came in today, I gave them a try for embossing.
The resulting unmodulated groove is super quiet, and easily trackable!
I was very happy with that result.

Upon trying to cut some audio, I had only distorted output, even at low levels.
Maybe some tweaking is in order, and I'll try to look under a different microscope, though I think it's a bust for embossing with these.

[studiorp]

Why distorted levels at the output ?

[tragwag]

I don't know exactly why, but I'm guessing the stylus geometry is different.

[opcode66]

This is just my instincts talking. No hard data.

They sound bad cutting because they have no burnishing facets. The difference between a smooth groove wall and a rough noisey one.

[tragwag]

This is just my instincts talking. No hard data.
They sound bad cutting because they have no burnishing facets. The difference between a smooth groove wall and a rough noisey one.

that's definitely an option, probably also the basic geometry of the stylus. angle of the facets, size of the facets, etc.

Don't get me wrong, the seller is absolutely right in selling these, and they are brand new.
They just don't seem to be for embossing for playback with a modern stylus.
I wish I had a finer microscope to take some photos.

[opcode66]

I misread your post. Thought you said you embossed then cut. You just embossed. So, burnishing facets would make zero difference.

[Stevie342000]

Could the issue be that you are cutting a groove with a Standard Stylus with 80 degree cutting facets and that you are trying to play them back with a micro-groove stylus, perhaps?

A Standard Groove styli is 3 mil and a micro-groove is only 1-mil, if memory serves me right.

If this is the case then you would be playing the bottom of the groove which would account for the excess noise. Just a thought......refer back to earlier post in this thread and look at the photos?

[tragwag]

Could the issue be that you are cutting a groove with a Standard Stylus with 80 degree cutting facets and that you are trying to play them back with a micro-groove stylus, perhaps?

A Standard Groove styli is 3 mil and a micro-groove is only 1-mil, if memory serves me right.

If this is the case then you would be playing the bottom of the groove which would account for the excess noise. Just a thought......refer back to earlier post in this thread and look at the photos?

Yeah, I'm not properly "cutting" the groove, I'm embossing.
which it's even more still not really right for the job.

[Stevie342000]

Yeah point taken, but it does not really matter if you are cutting or embossing, if those are Standard Groove Profile cutting styli then you will need a standard groove replay styli. Which means you may need 78rpm Profile styli, if you cutting in stereo then you may run in to issues with replay as most 78 rpm styli and cartridges come in mono form. No vertical compliance or very little which will damage the groove.

As Opcode pointed out if there are no burnishing facets then it does not matter if you are embossing but that may make a difference if you cutting. The styli were very reasonably price and very good for experimenting with.

I do hope someone like Shank has bought one or two so he can get some new styli manufactured with the standard groove profile, nothing wrong with cutting 78's. It's an even smaller market sector but it still exists non the less. Once he has the profile sorted out perhaps they could think about putting some burnishing facets on them. I have a feeling that burnishing facets came in at some point in the mid-1940s. Isobel Capps did some research on that sure it is mentioned in the Boden book or perhaps on American Broadcast site in one of the Audio magazines.

I wish I had bought a couple of them to play around with to get the feel of my cutting lathe, which should be up and running in the next month or two.

[The Shank]

No I haven't, but it's a good idea Steve!

[studiorp]

To tragwag a question, what pickup do you use for play records ?

[alexsation]

New ad on ebey http://www.ebay.com/itm/Vinyl-record-lathe-cutter-head-presto-record-stylus-needle-styli-recorder-/121537576569?&_trksid=p2056016.m2516.l5255

[Big Al]

Does anyone think its possible to somehow make these finer / smaller by sharpening so that they would be suitable
for embossing microgrooves?

If so how would this be done?

[rsimms3]

Had a gift card and bought a cheap USB microscope. Took a few pictures of these styli (I bought a ruby and a sapphire, both are the same cuts) and a old steel stylus I've been using with good results for embossing. The problem is that these styli are not ground to a peak on the back side (actually it's rounded/flat) and don't have sharp tips.

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[rsimms3]

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[Big Al]

Great pics! really shows the difference

[Jolyman]

Hello,

I did not know about microgrooves and 78 RPM diferent groove ...
So I've purchased many of them fot cutting or embossing polycarbonate.
did not cut well, did not emboss right.
now I know why.
I need to learn how to sharp them, I have 60 stylus here and not use for them ....
I hope somebody can help me.

here are the pictures I've taken today with my microscope










Thank you !

[opcode66]

Ahhh the stylus business....

Me personally, I would ask for a refund. There is nothing you can do with them. In order to properly regrind them, they would need to be freed from the shanks, reground, then set again in a shank. May as well add a heating wire while you're at it. But, when you look at the raw cost for this sort of stone, you ask yourself, why bother? At least, if you are a rational person you would. Sapphire is cheap as hell in comparison to diamond. There is little purpose in regrinding sapphire stones. Just start fresh. So, to answer your question, in short, no, there is nothing you can do without a 20K+ investment in some grinding gear. And, even then, it would be more cost effective to start with fresh materials.

The seller also stated not to use heat. The reason is that the glue used to set these wouldn't stand up to heat and the stone would fly out of the shank. Did I get that correct? I"m just expounding.

I identified months ago that these would not be functional just from analyzing pictures that were posted at the time. I would be fairly upset if I had purchased 60 x $15 = $900 worth of completely useless styli. Then again, why are these for sale if they aren't tested and proved???? Or were they tested and they are being sold with the knowledge that they are useless which is why the price is $15? Hmmm..... I guess we'll never actually know. Anyway, sucks for you for sure.

[Jolyman]

He can't buy them back from me ....
I have lost US900 to learn that.
I'm sad.