Finally I got a record lathe.
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- the_ducktail
- Posts: 105
- Joined: Thu Dec 20, 2012 8:08 am
Finally I got a record lathe.
After years of looking for a record lathe finally I found one in Texas and I bought it. Maybe you think its not a big deal. but for me it is. I spend the money of a motorcycle that I wanted to buy this crap but its here im so fucking happy. it was a whole mess. I bought it at ebay and then we start with the sad part of paying shipping for this from Texas to South America, Chile. the last country at South hemisphere. Anyway Im a rockabilly singer and i really want this to do my own recordings. Record cutter was stucked at Chilean custom due to it was declared more than $1000 usd, and they overcharged me about $500 usd or so just to release it, not including the shipping costs for about $700 usd or so. I went to the Chilean custom so many times that I even have friends over there now many people try to help me and Im proud of it. Many people instructing me on how to avoid costs or reduce payment. I explained to them that this was just an old record player (not a cutter), I was not cheatin' it is a record player too so all found it unfair to charge so much money for just an old record player. Anyway after a few days going to the airport and fedex office at Santiago, they told me to wait for fedex to do me an offer or a discount. I have no money so anyway I couldnt afford a payment of $500 usd, So I wait and I wait for over a month. Once at work I received a phone call indicating that If I didnt pay the $500 usd they will detroy the record latte. The guy at fedex told me about this so I explain I was short of money and even when I want it to pay I wouldnt be able to do it. weeks passed by and I was waiting for my second phone call to strike em with an offer. but yesterday when I went back home from work, record cutter was there. Shit, I dont know how to explain this. it was something incredible. I didnt pay and they send it home anyway. It was kind of a miracle. Unit was damaged but nothing to worry about. some scratches but just cosmetic condition. the one thing that worries me about its that the arm does not fit the plate pin softly, but its just an adjustment. cool stuff, it came with 8 brand new discs to test and play the equipment, brand new recordio. and 8 or 9 record cutter needles, steel and diamond. so this weekend I will dedicate to this beauty, also I dont want to get anxious and commit a mistake. please can anyone help me on a kinf of check list before plug in this rek o kut. thanks a lot to my friends: JC, who drove me to the airport first time. Dusty, who lend me some money (already paid) and push me to continue on this idea. My mom for all her support even when all my lifes ideas have been useless. my girlfriend who lend me part of the money for this and support me when I want it to quit or kill fedex guys at home. And of course all LATHE TROLLS Specially to my friend MARKROB who help me a lot suggesting me prices and sutff. fuck you all who told me that my ideas are stupid and that record cutters are not real and there are no machines like this. jajajajaa. watch the pictures. I will post new pictures of the arrival and real damage.
Anybody does one of this working to help me with the set up. or suggest me equipment to start recording? thanks.
Seems Siomn has one. can you help me contacting him. regards.
Anybody does one of this working to help me with the set up. or suggest me equipment to start recording? thanks.
Seems Siomn has one. can you help me contacting him. regards.
Re: Finally I got a record lathe.
Hi,
Congrats on finally scoring one of these babies! Looks like its in great shape. You should have it running in no time. The Audax head should be a nice one to start with for rockabilly. I see Deke Dickerson posts on here sometimes. He may be able to give you some recording tips. One thing you will have to deal with is that if Wikipedia is correct, you use 220V 50Hz AC mains in Chile. The motor on you machine is almost for sure setup for 120V 60Hz. If you get a step down transformer to reduce the 220 to 120, you will find that the motor runs slow due to the 50hz line frequency. You can compensate for this by cutting your material at reduced playback speed (-16.67% the ratio of 50hz vs. 60hz). In the digital world this is pretty easy. Not so easy in the analog world. If this seems too difficult to deal with, you will have to do one of 3 things:
1. Find a replacement motor with the correct shaft speed, hp, and mounting that works at 220V 50hz
2. Have a new pulley machined for you existing motor to bring the speed back to standard (you will still need a step down transformer)
3. Purchase a single phase variable frequency drive to run the existing motor (it needs to produce 120V at 60Hz with enough power for you motor).
As far as driving the head, if its 8 or 16 ohms, you'll have no trouble using any decent solid state or tube audio amp.
Keep us up to date on your progress getting things running.
Mark
Congrats on finally scoring one of these babies! Looks like its in great shape. You should have it running in no time. The Audax head should be a nice one to start with for rockabilly. I see Deke Dickerson posts on here sometimes. He may be able to give you some recording tips. One thing you will have to deal with is that if Wikipedia is correct, you use 220V 50Hz AC mains in Chile. The motor on you machine is almost for sure setup for 120V 60Hz. If you get a step down transformer to reduce the 220 to 120, you will find that the motor runs slow due to the 50hz line frequency. You can compensate for this by cutting your material at reduced playback speed (-16.67% the ratio of 50hz vs. 60hz). In the digital world this is pretty easy. Not so easy in the analog world. If this seems too difficult to deal with, you will have to do one of 3 things:
1. Find a replacement motor with the correct shaft speed, hp, and mounting that works at 220V 50hz
2. Have a new pulley machined for you existing motor to bring the speed back to standard (you will still need a step down transformer)
3. Purchase a single phase variable frequency drive to run the existing motor (it needs to produce 120V at 60Hz with enough power for you motor).
As far as driving the head, if its 8 or 16 ohms, you'll have no trouble using any decent solid state or tube audio amp.
Keep us up to date on your progress getting things running.
Mark
Re: Finally I got a record lathe.
Yes, compliments, it's always a Rek o kut, it's a very good machine and well built.
- Angus McCarthy
- Posts: 760
- Joined: Mon Aug 23, 2010 6:22 pm
- Location: Bloomsburg, PA, USA
Re: Finally I got a record lathe.
Sounds like somebody at customs was trying to fleece you and must have given up after a while. Congrats!
- the_ducktail
- Posts: 105
- Joined: Thu Dec 20, 2012 8:08 am
Re: Finally I got a record lathe.
Dear Markrob:
thanks again for your advices. Deke Dickerson, seems that my guitar player was in a gig once with him. that sure will be fine. I will ask for an email or something. Maybe its a good idea to record cut this at low playback speed. I will give ir a try, if this works I will upload the first recordings soon. about the options:
1-I dont want to change the motor, its like my recorders heart
2-that pulley option seems to be great. to avoid always to be fixing recording speed at computer.
3- Do you know where can I find something like that?
Can I use a tube preamp? I also have a marshall 120 watts amp and a Samson power mixer and a bunch of microphones. something of this is useful to record?
thanks again
thanks again for your advices. Deke Dickerson, seems that my guitar player was in a gig once with him. that sure will be fine. I will ask for an email or something. Maybe its a good idea to record cut this at low playback speed. I will give ir a try, if this works I will upload the first recordings soon. about the options:
1-I dont want to change the motor, its like my recorders heart
2-that pulley option seems to be great. to avoid always to be fixing recording speed at computer.
3- Do you know where can I find something like that?
Can I use a tube preamp? I also have a marshall 120 watts amp and a Samson power mixer and a bunch of microphones. something of this is useful to record?
thanks again
- the_ducktail
- Posts: 105
- Joined: Thu Dec 20, 2012 8:08 am
Re: Finally I got a record lathe.
Studiorp:
Thanks a lot any advice will be appreciated
Thanks a lot any advice will be appreciated
- the_ducktail
- Posts: 105
- Joined: Thu Dec 20, 2012 8:08 am
Re: Finally I got a record lathe.
Angus McCarthy:
The only thing I know is that, it was Devils or Gods help. but was something about supernatural forces jajajaaja
The only thing I know is that, it was Devils or Gods help. but was something about supernatural forces jajajaaja
Re: Finally I got a record lathe.
Hi,the_ducktail wrote:Dear Markrob:
thanks again for your advices. Deke Dickerson, seems that my guitar player was in a gig once with him. that sure will be fine. I will ask for an email or something. Maybe its a good idea to record cut this at low playback speed. I will give ir a try, if this works I will upload the first recordings soon. about the options:
1-I dont want to change the motor, its like my recorders heart
2-that pulley option seems to be great. to avoid always to be fixing recording speed at computer.
3- Do you know where can I find something like that?
Can I use a tube preamp? I also have a marshall 120 watts amp and a Samson power mixer and a bunch of microphones. something of this is useful to record?
thanks again
You will have to find a machine shop to have this piece custom made. You need to remove the existing pulley from the motor shaft and have this measured. Once measured, you just have to change the diameters in proportion to the line frequency difference. For example, if the current 45 RPM pulley diameter is 5mm, then you would increase it by 60/50 or 1.2 : 1 to 6mm to bring the speed back to spec. You may need to trim this diameter a bit as there may be some tolerances that affect the speed. So, I'd start a bit oversize (maybe 2%) and check the actual speed with a strobe disc. Then re-machine as needed to get the speeds correct.
As far amps go, a tube preamp or amp is fine. You will also need some EQ (for the RIAA curve and to correct for the head response). 50 watts should be more than enough. If you are planning to use a Marshall guitar amp, I'd re-think this. While it may work, its not really a Hi-Fi amplifer (its voiced to sound great with a guitar).
Mark
- the_ducktail
- Posts: 105
- Joined: Thu Dec 20, 2012 8:08 am
Re: Finally I got a record lathe.
Markrob, do you think this will work?
http://www.ebay.com/itm/1-HP-Variable-Frequency-Drive-Inverter-Phase-Converter-NEMA-1-200-240-1-Phase/290908294742?_trksid=p2045573.m2102&_trkparms=aid%3D555003%26algo%3DPW.CAT%26ao%3D2%26asc%3D146%26meid%3D7505955471194760519%26pid%3D100034%26prg%3D1079%26rk%3D1%26sd%3D180872169456%26#ht_2423wt_1228
http://www.ebay.com/itm/1-HP-Variable-Frequency-Drive-Inverter-Phase-Converter-NEMA-1-200-240-1-Phase/290908294742?_trksid=p2045573.m2102&_trkparms=aid%3D555003%26algo%3DPW.CAT%26ao%3D2%26asc%3D146%26meid%3D7505955471194760519%26pid%3D100034%26prg%3D1079%26rk%3D1%26sd%3D180872169456%26#ht_2423wt_1228
Re: Finally I got a record lathe.
If you want use the Rek o Kut as other semi-pro lathes in the way in which God " commands", I would recommend to transform it with a high-torque dj direct drive motor below the platter, but in your case perhaps this solution is very difficult. Why dd-motor? Because you will haven't no speed flutter, and no vibrations.
But there is a but, because I believe that your machine mount a Bodine or similar motor, so I think that is better replace the original brass (?) pulley and do a new piece for drive the platter with a belt as a normal turntable.
Good work.
But there is a but, because I believe that your machine mount a Bodine or similar motor, so I think that is better replace the original brass (?) pulley and do a new piece for drive the platter with a belt as a normal turntable.
Good work.
- the_ducktail
- Posts: 105
- Joined: Thu Dec 20, 2012 8:08 am
Re: Finally I got a record lathe.
During next weekend I will conect the record lathe with the step down tranformer. to see everything is working fine, And will upload photos of motor and pulleys for some of you give me an idea thanks in advanceIf you want use the Rek o Kut as other semi-pro lathes in the way in which God " commands", I would recommend to transform it with a high-torque dj direct drive motor below the platter, but in your case perhaps this solution is very difficult. Why dd-motor? Because you will haven't no speed flutter, and no vibrations.
But there is a but, because I believe that your machine mount a Bodine or similar motor, so I think that is better replace the original brass (?) pulley and do a new piece for drive the platter with a belt as a normal turntable.
Good work.
Re: Finally I got a record lathe.
the_ducktail wrote:Markrob, do you think this will work?
http://www.ebay.com/itm/1-HP-Variable-Frequency-Drive-Inverter-Phase-Converter-NEMA-1-200-240-1-Phase/290908294742?_trksid=p2045573.m2102&_trkparms=aid%3D555003%26algo%3DPW.CAT%26ao%3D2%26asc%3D146%26meid%3D7505955471194760519%26pid%3D100034%26prg%3D1079%26rk%3D1%26sd%3D180872169456%26#ht_2423wt_1228
I don't think so. Its 240 V single phase in 240V 3 phase out. As was stated in another post, its hard to find a single phase VFD. If you are interested, I can help you make your own drive electronics using an off the shelf oscillator, audio power amplifier and matching transformer. I think the mechanical modification is the easiest to do. I'm sure you can find a qualified machinist in Chile that can help you out. Should be no trouble to find a step down transformer as well.
I want to make some corrections. I see from your pictures that the Rek-O-Kut uses stepped idlers to make the speed changes. Normally an idler has no bearing on the platter speed, but this is the exception. In this arrangement, the motor shaft pulley is fixed diameter and the ratio of the two rubber idler diameters determines the platter speed. So, you have two ways to bring the speed up to specification. You can have new idlers fabricated for 45 and 33 speeds or you can increase the motor shaft pulley diameter to accomplish the same thing. Its not clear if the motor pulley is press fit or secured by a set screw. If you have idlers (or can get them) for the speeds you need, I'd work on the motor shaft pulley. But either way, you should be able to get this running.
If you just want to get some cutting experience, you can live with the off speed platter for now and just get the step down transformer (which you need anyway) and make sure your motor is ok. If you play back using the pickup on the lathe, your cuts will be at the correct pitch (just not compatible with a standard turntable). But at least you'll gain experience and be able to evaluate and fix all of the other issues that you find.
Mark
- the_ducktail
- Posts: 105
- Joined: Thu Dec 20, 2012 8:08 am
Re: Finally I got a record lathe.
Hey Markrob:
I called to a transformers store and they sold me optimus prime No, jajaa. I called to a transformer store and the seller told me that If I used the step down transformer the record lathe will work at same speed required but motor will get hotter faster than normal. I trust you so I think the guy is wrong but, can you have an idea if that is possible or something? I dont want to screw my lathe up overheating it. Anyway I will plug it in and will use the record player only to know if speed is at the correct RPM. let you know asap.
I called to a transformers store and they sold me optimus prime No, jajaa. I called to a transformer store and the seller told me that If I used the step down transformer the record lathe will work at same speed required but motor will get hotter faster than normal. I trust you so I think the guy is wrong but, can you have an idea if that is possible or something? I dont want to screw my lathe up overheating it. Anyway I will plug it in and will use the record player only to know if speed is at the correct RPM. let you know asap.
Re: Finally I got a record lathe.
Hi,
Make sure it is a true "hunk of iron" style step down transformer, not some solid state voltage converter. The motor needs to see a nice clean sine wave. Not some chopped approximation (or it will run hot). You also need to size the transformer according to the power needed by the motor. Look at the rating plate and you should see a horsepower rating (a typical motor in this type of application would be in the range of 1/25 HP). Since 1 HP = 749 watts, you can get a rough idea of the needed transformer size by calculating the output power (the rating plate number) and add a factor of 2 to be safe (bigger is better, but more costly). So, in the case of a 1/25 HP motor, you would calculate 30 Watts (749/25) and double this to end up with a 60 watt transformer size. You could probably get away with a 50 watt unit, but I would go bigger to be safe. Because you are running at a lower line frequency than designed, the motor will run a bit hotter, but it should be ok.
Mark
Make sure it is a true "hunk of iron" style step down transformer, not some solid state voltage converter. The motor needs to see a nice clean sine wave. Not some chopped approximation (or it will run hot). You also need to size the transformer according to the power needed by the motor. Look at the rating plate and you should see a horsepower rating (a typical motor in this type of application would be in the range of 1/25 HP). Since 1 HP = 749 watts, you can get a rough idea of the needed transformer size by calculating the output power (the rating plate number) and add a factor of 2 to be safe (bigger is better, but more costly). So, in the case of a 1/25 HP motor, you would calculate 30 Watts (749/25) and double this to end up with a 60 watt transformer size. You could probably get away with a 50 watt unit, but I would go bigger to be safe. Because you are running at a lower line frequency than designed, the motor will run a bit hotter, but it should be ok.
Mark
- the_ducktail
- Posts: 105
- Joined: Thu Dec 20, 2012 8:08 am
Re: Finally I got a record lathe.
Hey Markrob et all:
I took a picture will upload later. but info goes like this:
rek -o- kut
SER. No.: 71624
MODEL: IMP-2
115 v.: 46/55
WATTS: 60/50 CY
Thats what appear in a small plate on a corner. Hope this provide any kind of idea of what kind of equipment this is.
I also download a manual from this site. thanks.
I took a picture will upload later. but info goes like this:
rek -o- kut
SER. No.: 71624
MODEL: IMP-2
115 v.: 46/55
WATTS: 60/50 CY
Thats what appear in a small plate on a corner. Hope this provide any kind of idea of what kind of equipment this is.
I also download a manual from this site. thanks.
Re: Finally I got a record lathe.
Hi,
It would be good to get the info off of the motor as well.
Mark
It would be good to get the info off of the motor as well.
Mark
- the_ducktail
- Posts: 105
- Joined: Thu Dec 20, 2012 8:08 am
Re: Finally I got a record lathe.
Ok I will post that tomorrow Im at the office right now
- the_ducktail
- Posts: 105
- Joined: Thu Dec 20, 2012 8:08 am
Re: Finally I got a record lathe.
heres how I receive it.